Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Persian Chauvinisim
Article listed on WP:VFD July 12 to July 18 2004, consensus was to delete. Archived dicussion:
Re: Persian Chauvinisim
The article is on a misspelled term and is very pointed. Not much will remain after removing POV. --Roozbeh 23:17, 12 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- Delete - The same user has created numerous completely false articles, and has altered some correct articles to his pointed versions under at least the following names and/or IP's: Emilkhan / AytanKarahan / 198.81.26.9 / 198.81.26.17 / 198.81.26.41 / 198.81.26.44 / 198.81.26.74 and others. His "contributions" have not only ruined a number of Wikipedia articles and created new false ones, but also this person has caused a number of Wikipedia admins as well as regular contributors to waste signifant amount of time because of him, time that would normally have been used in a positive way to contribute to improvement of Wikipedia. --K1 23:58, 12 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- Pointless article. There is indeed something like a Persian chauvinistic worldview, but so what. Such views exist in proabbly every single nation particularly multi-ethnic states and there is nothing special in the fact that some Persians have less than favourable views of their neighbours/co-stake holders in the Iranian state. Just delete it. Otherwise we can add articles ranging from Aboriginal Chavinism to Zulu chauvinism, all containing more or less the same wording. Delete please --Refdoc 00:12, 13 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- [Del??] The article is indeed a bit pointless.--Refdoc 00:01, 13 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- Delete. This article has very little value and will probably confuse rather than educate viewers of it.--Arminius 03:01, 13 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- Delete. Intrinsically POV; the correctly spelled term should redirect to something like Minorities in Iran. - Mustafaa 04:22, 13 Jul 2004 (UTC)
Keep.Keep if revised as described in the following (vote revised Wile E. Heresiarch 13:45, 13 Jul 2004 (UTC)). Rename to Policy toward ethnic minorities in Iran or something. It's easy enough to cut out the ranting, and what's left should be verifiable. E.g., it's claimed minorities are calling for independent republics, so list some major players and the dates they made their pronouncements. It's claimed the theocracy has continued the policies of the Shah toward minorities, so refer to some laws. -- It's clear enough that there is axe-grinding and agenda-pushing on both sides of this article. However it's an important topic, so let's try to clean it up. I'm not ready to give up on it yet. Wile E. Heresiarch 04:40, 13 Jul 2004 (UTC)- I am sure if I wrote an article about the discrimination against left-handed Tibetan law students in North America, someone would find it "interesting" and would see some ostensibly reasonable arguments "on both sides of the issue" --- but that does not make the article a legitimate one. And that is precisely what this guy is trying to achieve (mind you, it's just one guy, all with AOL IP's and with an unmistakable political agenda). I am Iranian myself. There are hardly any Iranians who are not originating from various Iranian groups if you go just a few generations back in their family tree. I myself have Persian, Azari, Luri and Mazandarani in me, and that is if you go back just 4 generations!! Unlike what this guy is trying to portray, the vast majority of Iranian Azarbaijanis are extremely nationalistic. In fact, I would say they are the most nationalistic of all Iranian groups. And even though they are Turkish speaking, the vast majority of them consider themselves Iranians who, due to historical turn of events, the language of their region has changed. Their cultural affinity is 100% with Iran and not with Turkey and they have a better command of the Persian langauge than most other Iranians. The former Shah of Iran, by the way, was of a Mazandarani father and an Azari mother; he was not ethnically "Persian". The present supreme leader of the Islamic Republic of Iran, Ayatollah Khamenei, on his grandfather side is from Azarbaijan (Khamenei means from the village of Khamene, which is in Azarbaijan) and the rest of him is at least partly from Khorasan. For the overwhelming majority of Iranians, the ethnicity of other Iranians is not an issue that exists in their conscious mind or at least it is not an important factor --- so what is the basis of discrimination in Iran? You guessed it right: religion! And the most ardent "Shiites" of all Iranians, are indeed the Azarbaijanis. This guy is just trying to muddy up the water and promote his Pan-Turkist agenda which is rooted in Ankara, and not in Iran. --K1 05:57, 13 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- All right. (1) Nobody said anything about left-handed Tibetans. Let's stick to the topic, shall we. (2) I used the term "important", not "interesting", to describe the topic. (3) That said, the current revision needs a lot of work. I'm not willing to do it, but if the original author or anyone else wants to take the time to cut the agenda promotion and put in some substantiating references, then great, it will be a good article. If not revised, then dump it and wait for a better version. (4) If in fact the multitude of ethnic groups in Iran coexist in peace and harmony, that in itself would be worth an article. It's pretty uncommon, I'm afraid. But, K1, you're certainly under no obligation to write such an article; it's just an idea. Regards, Wile E. Heresiarch 13:45, 13 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- I am sure if I wrote an article about the discrimination against left-handed Tibetan law students in North America, someone would find it "interesting" and would see some ostensibly reasonable arguments "on both sides of the issue" --- but that does not make the article a legitimate one. And that is precisely what this guy is trying to achieve (mind you, it's just one guy, all with AOL IP's and with an unmistakable political agenda). I am Iranian myself. There are hardly any Iranians who are not originating from various Iranian groups if you go just a few generations back in their family tree. I myself have Persian, Azari, Luri and Mazandarani in me, and that is if you go back just 4 generations!! Unlike what this guy is trying to portray, the vast majority of Iranian Azarbaijanis are extremely nationalistic. In fact, I would say they are the most nationalistic of all Iranian groups. And even though they are Turkish speaking, the vast majority of them consider themselves Iranians who, due to historical turn of events, the language of their region has changed. Their cultural affinity is 100% with Iran and not with Turkey and they have a better command of the Persian langauge than most other Iranians. The former Shah of Iran, by the way, was of a Mazandarani father and an Azari mother; he was not ethnically "Persian". The present supreme leader of the Islamic Republic of Iran, Ayatollah Khamenei, on his grandfather side is from Azarbaijan (Khamenei means from the village of Khamene, which is in Azarbaijan) and the rest of him is at least partly from Khorasan. For the overwhelming majority of Iranians, the ethnicity of other Iranians is not an issue that exists in their conscious mind or at least it is not an important factor --- so what is the basis of discrimination in Iran? You guessed it right: religion! And the most ardent "Shiites" of all Iranians, are indeed the Azarbaijanis. This guy is just trying to muddy up the water and promote his Pan-Turkist agenda which is rooted in Ankara, and not in Iran. --K1 05:57, 13 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- Delete. -Sean Curtin 06:35, 13 Jul 2004 (UTC)
No voteDelete - the topic is good but the title seems abstract - Tεxτurε 15:23, 13 Jul 2004 (UTC)
I have added a new article Ethnic minorities in Iran. See what you think. I tried to salvage what was useful - i.e. huge ethnic diversity + related challenges, while removing POV. I think this should remove the last argument for keeping the chauvinism article Refdoc 21:54, 13 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- Delete. -Farshadrbn 15:07, 16 Jul 2004 (UTC)
- Delete. (User: Mani). This "article" is a part of the pan-Turkist mission of spreading hate among the people of Middle-east. It is a propagandistic article aimed at causing hate against a group of people. In my opinion, such a propaganda should be deleted in an encyclopaedia.
- Delete.--Sina 22:38, 17 Jul 2004 (UTC)